change of plan. I need a work out so have decided to do the St Neot's Paris Roubaix Ride. Fly the flag for CCA. hope my funny tendon on the ball of my foot doesn't say BAD IDEA.
have a good ride all. your route tomorrow is a lovely one.
Beautiful morning with 12 out which became a baker's dozen when we met up with Toma. Thanks to Mark for resolving a couple of navigation issues to avoid my unintentional off-road section. Well done to Archie and thanks to all for a great morning. In the end 41.6 miles at 15.3.
Thanks James - really enjoyable club run.
BUT - not sure we rode well as a group today given the purpose of this ride.
Steady needs discipline and selflessness.
Reckon some of the group (myself included) need some help.
Yes, thanks James, enjoyable route and ride. Great company and a chance to catch up with some club mates I haven't seen for ages.
I agree Jeremy, it could have been better disciplined pace wise. The first half was good but then it deteriorated a bit. I have spent many years doing domestique duties pacing Mrs Wyer and I gauge a consistent effort rather than speed. I try and settle into an effort that is working for her and keep that going.
In addition we were very ragged at times with the outside riders sometimes in the middle of the road and not always in pairs. It can look like we are three abreast from behind. It's also much harder to keep a neat formation if some are struggling to hold the pace. Forcing the pace is also counter productive because the extra effort slower riders have to make to keep up means they tend to be more tired later and therefore even slower. I also shouldn't have pushed it on a couple of the descents which broke things up a bit so apologies for that.
Our youth riders have been the more disciplined participants in these club runs. We occasionally let them off the leash on tough climbs but otherwise they ride steadily without half wheeling. They are also better at riding close to others.
Of course they have had many coaching sessions whilst most of us older riders haven't so I would expect them to be more disciplined. The club coaches are always happy to run some coaching sessions for adult members but in the past we haven't had great take up.
I don't want to make a major issue of it but I think we can make good rides even better. Thanks for your thoughts Jeremy.
Mark, your help would be much appreciated, I'm sure.
I've heard several people on both Saturday club rides saying they don't feel confident in a group. What's actually more off-putting to me is risky behaviour from the stronger, more confident riders. Not holding your line, overlapping wheels, sudden changes of pace, not being in control of your bike etc don't just put 1 person at risk, but they jeopardise the safety of the whole group.
Lately on club rides, people are getting dropped in spite of calls to ease the pace. (I can't think of one case when the dropped person wasn't capable. All he/she needed was a little more consideration and support - and we all know we're capable of giving this.) It makes me wonder if individual strength has suddenly become more 'worthy' at CCA than good group riding skills?
Apart from the safety issues (and the reputation of our club) if we don't get better at this, really good group-riding can be an utterly exhilarating experience. So why wouldn't we want to get better at it?
Could you perhaps coach us during a few club rides? Learning-on-the-job, so to speak, rather than a specific skills session.
Might be unrelated but we need someone to take the lead on a faster club run on the weekends or for two groups to be created on the day for riders wanting a pacier ride.
There does not seem to be an offering for these on the forum. The sat 8am is a harder medium to fast ride but not sure if one exists anymore on Sunday. This is probably because those that would organise a longer or slightly pacier ride in the winter normally race but if there are enough wanting to ride 18mph plus then come forward and put a posting on forum.
Good to hear others highlight the need for tighter groups. "Two abreast, keep tight keep in", all mean it's looking very scrappy up front and may be hazardous for the individual or group.
I think this is largely a problem of discipline and above all concentration. We all know the club run guidelines, not overlapping wheels, riding bar to bar etc, we can all do it but it can get forgotton about while we are chatting away and enjoying the sunshine.
Maybe we should just take a moment to think. If you are in the middle of the bunch and you are chatting away, every half a minute just think "am i bar to bar and nice and tight to my partner?" if you are on the front, every half a minute just think about the weaker riders behind, have a check and keep an eye out for whats coming up. If you are on the back, every half a minute look round to see if anyone has been dropped or look for traffic behind.
I think we all know this and its not really difficult, just requires a bit of thought and concentration.
It is not about speed so much as consideration. If it is a club ride it isn't a training ride. That means whatever speed the group goes or which one you are in the speed is determined by the slowest rider or least fit rider or the one who doesn't feel so good that day. It's a CLUB so ride as a club. If the ride is posted as a training ride then everyone knows that it will be at the pace of the one who posted the ride and you need to be able to stick with it or bale out when the going is too tough. That means you need to be aware of the route and how to get back by yourself. It's not hard folks. As to group skills you don't need to coach on the wheel but just exchange helpful words whilst chatting to your partner or those in front or behind. Don't think of it as coaching but constructive conversation. Some riders are better placed to offer advice from experience. Be confident and offer that advice. It's how to learn on the job. Sometimes accidents happen even knowing all the rules. A quick lapse of attention and wheels can touch even if moving through on the outside to take the front. When a line is moving through it is vital to keep the line and not to move out like some do when checking behind. This is a skill best learnt on the track where riders can discover in controlled conditions whether they have a tendency to swerve out when looking round. Some of our most experienced riders still haven't mastered what our youth riders know to do.
Comments
Sadly Alfie and i cant make it as im on football duty
JP
59k route
Very steady and can easily be made shorter, see you tomorrow.
have a good ride all. your route tomorrow is a lovely one.
Thanks to Mark for resolving a couple of navigation issues to avoid my unintentional off-road section.
Well done to Archie and thanks to all for a great morning.
In the end 41.6 miles at 15.3.
BUT - not sure we rode well as a group today given the purpose of this ride.
Steady needs discipline and selflessness.
Reckon some of the group (myself included) need some help.
Wondered what others thought?
I agree Jeremy, it could have been better disciplined pace wise. The first half was good but then it deteriorated a bit. I have spent many years doing domestique duties pacing Mrs Wyer and I gauge a consistent effort rather than speed. I try and settle into an effort that is working for her and keep that going.
In addition we were very ragged at times with the outside riders sometimes in the middle of the road and not always in pairs. It can look like we are three abreast from behind. It's also much harder to keep a neat formation if some are struggling to hold the pace. Forcing the pace is also counter productive because the extra effort slower riders have to make to keep up means they tend to be more tired later and therefore even slower. I also shouldn't have pushed it on a couple of the descents which broke things up a bit so apologies for that.
Our youth riders have been the more disciplined participants in these club runs. We occasionally let them off the leash on tough climbs but otherwise they ride steadily without half wheeling. They are also better at riding close to others.
Of course they have had many coaching sessions whilst most of us older riders haven't so I would expect them to be more disciplined. The club coaches are always happy to run some coaching sessions for adult members but in the past we haven't had great take up.
I don't want to make a major issue of it but I think we can make good rides even better. Thanks for your thoughts Jeremy.
Mark.
I've heard several people on both Saturday club rides saying they don't feel confident in a group. What's actually more off-putting to me is risky behaviour from the stronger, more confident riders. Not holding your line, overlapping wheels, sudden changes of pace, not being in control of your bike etc don't just put 1 person at risk, but they jeopardise the safety of the whole group.
Lately on club rides, people are getting dropped in spite of calls to ease the pace. (I can't think of one case when the dropped person wasn't capable. All he/she needed was a little more consideration and support - and we all know we're capable of giving this.) It makes me wonder if individual strength has suddenly become more 'worthy' at CCA than good group riding skills?
Apart from the safety issues (and the reputation of our club) if we don't get better at this, really good group-riding can be an utterly exhilarating experience. So why wouldn't we want to get better at it?
Could you perhaps coach us during a few club rides? Learning-on-the-job, so to speak, rather than a specific skills session.
There does not seem to be an offering for these on the forum. The sat 8am is a harder medium to fast ride but not sure if one exists anymore on Sunday. This is probably because those that would organise a longer or slightly pacier ride in the winter normally race but if there are enough wanting to ride 18mph plus then come forward and put a posting on forum.
Good to hear others highlight the need for tighter groups. "Two abreast, keep tight keep in", all mean it's looking very scrappy up front and may be hazardous for the individual or group.
Maybe we should just take a moment to think. If you are in the middle of the bunch and you are chatting away, every half a minute just think "am i bar to bar and nice and tight to my partner?" if you are on the front, every half a minute just think about the weaker riders behind, have a check and keep an eye out for whats coming up. If you are on the back, every half a minute look round to see if anyone has been dropped or look for traffic behind.
I think we all know this and its not really difficult, just requires a bit of thought and concentration.
However there was some interest at the club meeting yesterday evening for a coaching session - see separate thread.
As to group skills you don't need to coach on the wheel but just exchange helpful words whilst chatting to your partner or those in front or behind. Don't think of it as coaching but constructive conversation. Some riders are better placed to offer advice from experience. Be confident and offer that advice. It's how to learn on the job. Sometimes accidents happen even knowing all the rules. A quick lapse of attention and wheels can touch even if moving through on the outside to take the front. When a line is moving through it is vital to keep the line and not to move out like some do when checking behind. This is a skill best learnt on the track where riders can discover in controlled conditions whether they have a tendency to swerve out when looking round. Some of our most experienced riders still haven't mastered what our youth riders know to do.